Unfortunatly
 

I thought this would happen. It was mentioned that if you do not post, you may be "blocked" from the video section. So what happens...alot of people now post one word posts and one pic posts. This, to me detracts from the enjoyment of the forums. It is also, IMO a cheap way to get your post count up. I apologise for the negativity, but this is a current trend that I think many will not like.

vorlord,

This trend shouldn't last too long. Getting into the video forums will not be based solely on post count. People are going to have to be willing to post photos and videos to be considered for the upgrade.

Thanks,

what about?
 

What about the people who actually have stuff to say and contribute? Is your system going to automatically let us into the vid. forums after we hit x number of posts? what's the number?

No there is no automated system in place to upgrade members yet.

We will post information next week when we decide how to handle upgrading members to have access to the video forums.

Thanks,

personal excuse
 

I'm not entirely sure if this is the best solution and here is why - I only have 1 or 2 posts, haven't been counting, because I'm a lurker and don't have any content to add. But I'm sure that there are plenty of people just like me who have 5 posts, but they spam up the boards with "thank you" messages.

I consider "thank you" messages, especially from people who leave them all the time, to be spam clogging up the board. They add extra pages and for people with slower connections, they get only one video per page (sometimes none) over a 17-page thread, in the most extreme cases. No one reads the thank yous except for the poster - and if the person doing the thanking is truly that sincere, then they should thank on a one-on-one basis, by email or so forth so the rest of us doesn't have to skim over it.

I don't think it's being ungrateful to speak so bluntly, because I'm glad that people who have the time and resources find all this great content. Some of us don't post content here, for whatever reason, and if you penalize us I guess we'll go find something else. This board was created, it seems, because there were problems with the E_N_F group. Over there, the posters didn't get so angry towards the rest of the members. Now this site is getting into similar problems, and I guess us lurkers will just move elsewhere, again.

Delete the post if you prefer, but thanks for making me forget about Yahoo Groups for a couple months.

I agree with some of this post, in that I'm not sure if only allowing those who post pics/videos access to the videos is a good thing to do. I know this will come across as a "lurker who doesn't contribute" post, but the thing is I have no clue where everyone gets their content. That's the whole reason I come here is because I can't find this stuff for myself on the net. Anything I find on the net is usually a)from other similar sites as this or b)already posted here. So for me, personally, the reason I'm not contributing is because I simply have no access to this stuff and simply do not know where to find "original" content to contribute.

But I do understand why this rule is in place. I can understand wanting to filter out those who don't really contribute anything, but I figure people can contribute positively in other ways without having to contribute actual pics or videos.

My 2 cents.

The "thank you" messages that you consider spam pay the bills for the host. Each posted reply causes a new page view for the advertising banners. You may think of these posts as spam, but they generate the ad revenue that helps keeps this site free.

good point
 

The second reply, from jake_dog, makes a good point but in doing so confirms at least part of my argument. While he has 8 posts (which is, of course, more than 5) none of those 8 contained any video or picture content.

His good point is that writing pages of "thank you" messages boosts ad revenue, since "each reply generates another ad page view." I didn't even think of that. I felt bad complaining about having to skim page after page of annoying "thank you" lists because I knew that the video posters appreciate it when people express their gratitude (in fact, some get pissed off when they aren't thanked: check out "A Lurker"s signature). I suggested, therefore, that people should thank their favorites individually, and there is even a capacity to do that on the website: click on a member's name above their post, and you can send them a private message through OCC. But if clogging up the video forums with pages full of "thank you" notes creates more ad revenue, then my argument is effectively destroyed.

So, I ask Alex: which way can we lurkers make you the most money? Maybe if you told us how the funding from the pay sites works, then we can help you out. I'm not above clicking the "refresh" button a couple of hundred times, as long as it's free.

(P.S. I don't want to have my point destroyed by anything 'ad hominem' because I haven't sent any private messages expressing my gratitude to any of you. Please argue against my idea and not against me.)

Some very good points are raised in this thread. I know how you feel as it took me a long time to get into the posting mode and, to be honest, this is really the only board that I visit reqularly. I drop in on others now and again, but for most of them I'd consider myself a lurker too. If those boards vanished, I don't think it'd impact me in any major way, but if OCC went bye-bye, I know I'd have to spend a lot more time hunting for vids and pics and probably would never be able to find the same level of quality that we see here.

Thanks for sharing your opinions and keeping this discussion civil.

I'll clear a few things up about how we get support from having sponsors. We don't generate any money from ad views or even by people clicking on ads, so there is no reason to encourage people to visit more pages or click on the links if they have no interest in joining a pay site. We do get paid a commission of around 50% of the sale price (and rebills), or sometimes we get a single sign up bonus between $15 and $40 depending on the site. To put things in perspective, the overall cost of running OCC is around $2,000 US dollars a month.

GUBA is by far our best and most popular sponsor. I feel pretty confident about recommending them to people because it is the only pay site I belong to right now. I've also been a member there for the past two years. They truely have something for everyone.

These last couple of weeks have been tough. We have been trying to make decisions where everyone will be happy, or have the opportunity to be happy in the future. Sometimes I feel like I'm balancing on a ball.

Things have been very busy this weekend and I'm sure they will get better (and easier) next week.

Please be patient with us and we'll be posting news as soon as it's available. For now, I'm just glad we were able to get the video forum back open and our server problems under control.

Thanks,

and the problem is?
 

<my$.02>
Well your problem is too much traffic. Now...most would see that as a good thing. I mean your site is more popular. I wish I could say the same for mine. It's not really fair to cut people off if they don't have content. I guess my thoughts are I hope you and your staff come up with a fair solution. Maybe it's time to start charging. I mean, most people would probably pay up to five or ten dollars a month. Or better yet, set up a pay pal donation system. You'd be suprised how well that works. Anyway, I was very suprised when I discovered this site and that it was free. Just don't overlook the fact that the community is what makes it a good site. Don't lose that atmosphere by 1) losing people to large charges or 2) driving people away just because they don't have something to "contribute."
</my$.02>

afterthough
 

Oh, and, if you could please give me access that would be great. I'm good for it... I have plenty ideas and hopefully some content to share.

My thoughts
 

I do agree that in order to view you should pitch in what you have. I had been lurking for a while (And I felt bad about that) just because I was way from my broadband and the dial up was to slow to upload anything.Trust me I tried. But now that I am back home I can start post some good stuff. I could have put up a ton of "Thank You's" to raise my posts but whats the point. It did piss me off alittle when I have to search thru all the TY's to find the content of the post. But I got over it. All in all I think this is a great site and it should stay free but only to those who put in.

On a side note to Alex: How many monerators (sp?) do you have. It seems like you are the only one who watches what people post. If you need more I am sure that people would help out to include me. Just a thought.


Mac

I'm a lurker mostly, and admittedly, I don't have much to share. I'd still like to be able to access the videos section. I think a direct donation to the website should be considered. I'd have no problem paying to access the video forum.

Oops
 

Alex,

Thanks for setting the record straight. So it's all commisions, and no CPM or CPC. Maybe a combination of the two might work, although some advertisers want to be the only banner on a page. Just a thought.

I for one, would hate to see this become a "club" where only those who post videos can download, but it seems to be headed that way. Would you be willing to consider a small yearly membership fee (pay pal donation) as an *optional* way of access to the videos for those who can't post often enough to keep that section open to them consistently?


Bob

There seems to be a lot more interest in adding the option of making a donation in exchange for access.

Our first priority will be to allow people who cotribute to have access to the video forums. After that, we may add the option of paying for access if people want to do it that way.

We aren't here to try to make a profit, just breaking even would be nice. In the long run, I want to keep everyone happy. It's not always easy.

Maybe I should start a poll...

Well, I guess that the bandwidth problems are starting to ruin the forums. A lot of people have nothing to contribute, but want the rewards, and the results have been obvious. It seems like most of these people are either really dumb, can not read directions, or are desperate and hope they will be admitted into video viewing once again despite not following the posting rules.

That said, is the problem solved by letting these people back on? I don't think so, but it has shown how much some people are willing to do to get their high quality free porn here.

As for a poll, I'll cast my vote now. This place is fantastic, (or used to be), but I'm not willing to make a PayPal donation. I'm sorry, I'm aware of the "community" argument, but it's a matter of principle. I have nothing to contribute, I will not give money, and so unless there's a third solution I can't think of, I'll go elsewhere. I don't want your sympathy (one angry poster said to another guy like me, "you contribute nothing to this forum and yet you want me to feel sorry for you", and I agree), and I'm not mad, either.

I don't approve of shutting access down to those of us who have nothing to share. But I don't run this site, and so for that reason it doesn't matter what I think. I just hope that the other lurkers will do the same (leave) instead of pathetically trying to regain access by breaking forum rules, clogging the forums, and making the bandwidth problem even worse than before.

Ive seen it a thousand times....
 

and will probably see it a thousand more. Someone decides to start up a great free community. Many people lurk, many others post. The word gets out that this site is awesome. Many more lurk. The site starts to lose bandwidth so they shut down temporarily to "redo" the site so all can enjoy again. When the site resurfaces, you are faced with usually 3 options. 1) Pay us, or leave. 2) Post for us, or leave. 3)Just leave. The "new" community then goes through a certain understandable chaotic struggle as the lurkers (who are in the vast majority) start jones-ing for the awesome content they have been getting for free. The others who actually post, spend awhile trying to right the ship and will succeed for a little while with numerous posts/ads/money. Those who cant meet the demands of the board generators fall by the wayside. Site loses credibility on other websites that usually praised it, causing lurkers to leave. The site keeps a tight knit community for awhile and curses those lurkers...who needs them anyway right? Site starts hemorraging...need new rules! Makes the entire site (pics and otherwise) meet up to their new standards and starts pissing off the "faithfull". Evryone goes crazy and....well you see where this is going.

Kind of reminds me of a drug-dealer. Here ya go...free samples for everyone. Hooked? Great! Now dance through hoops for me or pay me if you want more.

I was a lurker.
I will still lurk at places that haven't gotten too busy that they are now a police state ro full of greed.
I will see the rest of you lurkers there as well...oh, yeah maybe I wont =)

PS: I really did enjoy your site for quite awhile. All of my above statements arent 100% aimed at you, just a nice warning for it does happen frequently. I have never spoken out at said sites before, so when I see this fine establishment nosediving in that direction, I had to speak out. Its a shame too...was a very nice site. Please, for the sake of those who decide to stay, dont start telling them they MUST do this or that. Guidelines are one thing, constantly having your "membership" threatened if you dont DO this or PAY that... will end in destruction. Remember, its a voluntary community, not Beirut.

Alianate your members
 

Since 10% of the members post 99% of the vids and all of the members want to be able to view the vids, my guess is you are going to alienate 90% of your members by no longer allowing access to the vids.

What do the lurkers suggest?
 

While I understand where some of you are coming from with your points of view,somewhere along the line a solutuon to the bandwidth problem has to be found. Most of the complaints seem to be coming from members who haven't given very much to the forums and seem reluctant to give a small financial donation to help the community exist. What I would like to know is what these members suggest is done to solve the bandwidth problem. They are still getting free access to hundreds of pics and are only asked to make a small effort to give something back to the members who have made the effort to find and post material for all of us in order to access the vids. I dont think thats a difficult request. The quote that 90% of members will be unable to view the vids forums is exaggerated in my opinion but even if it were true would still leave over 2000 active members to view and share material.

Site Contribution
 

What is considered to be an adequate financial "contribution" in order to access the vids?

I know it must be frustrating for people to have to sort through the flood of new posts. A lot of good stuff has been posted lately, mixed in with all the reposts and posts that violate the rules. We are just getting too much material and it's over stimulating. It's hard to take the time to enjoy things right now. I'm optimistic and I would like to think that most people have good intentions here.

That's why we put a time limit on this. After January 31st, people should not be posting just to get in to the video forums. The process will be different. Let's try to be patient these next two weeks. Things will be getting back to normal soon.

Thanks,

One thing bothers me in all this.

What happens to the people who have joined GUBA etc from this site and thus paid the bandwidth up to now?

I know you are trying to keep the posters happy but lets make one thing clear - you say you pay $2,000 a month to keep this site going - but that isn't strictly true. People like me signing up for GUBA accounts have kept this site going. We paid most of that money. Didn't we?

Now I am a lurker yes... but the site wouldn't be here without people like me divvying up cash via some of the ad banners in the past. So to all you righteous file posters consider this for a moment... who paid the bills up to this point? You may have contributed to the files on the site - but we contributed to the costs of it.

What happens to us, Alex? Do we have pay again? Or will GUBA members who joined from this site get some way of upgrading?

Tuscan.

Tuscan, you raised an excellent point there that I hadn't even considered. It's going to take a better man than me to figure out this balancing act. :)

Actually I raised it mainly out of anger. Something I rarely if ever do. I had decided to pay the subscription in February (whatever it was) and leave it there. I mean i've had my fair use out of GUBA so I can't claim it was an entirely benovolent act signing up. I just got sick of people forgetting about the contribution made by people who have signed up to services via this website.

On the whole Alex does a fantastic job - I commend it - but it would be nice to be recognised as a supporter without having to post videos. In any case... i'll go with the Alex's decision... and if it means paying again then so be it.

Tuscan

I agree those who have helped to keep the site going through clicking on links and taking membership of our sponsors should be given a degree of consideration. However please dont be critical of the posters who after all took the time and effort to upload the videos for you to download. If they hadn't the site wouldn't be the great place it is now. With your access to Guba perhaps you could upload some of the tons of material you have downloaded?

What's the issue?
 

Alex, I pay and lurk at GUBA just like I pay and lurk at other sites. Let me know if and when you get a pay plan up and running.